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Author Topic: Black Holes or IP blocking?  (Read 10534 times)
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JustMe
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« Reply #255 on: July 06, 2008, 06:56:57 AM »

LOL.  So, cool. 
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« Reply #256 on: July 06, 2008, 09:08:16 AM »

I'll say it again...................menusux...........YOU ROCK Cool
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« Reply #257 on: July 06, 2008, 10:36:40 AM »

What a find!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Menusux to the rescue!!!  Now if you can just get us a site to run our tomatoes by before we eat them....
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kaffe
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« Reply #258 on: July 06, 2008, 11:30:57 AM »

Menusux has done it again!  THANK YOU Menu!   Cheesy
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3catkidneyfailure
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« Reply #259 on: July 06, 2008, 02:36:01 PM »

Menusux, any chance you'd take on the problems of HP's having AMD processors and updating
with Microsoft XP Service Pack 3? I've been in contact with HP and with Microsoft support regarding
the issues here of Intel images being loaded on HP AMD processor machines that cause an endless
reboot problem if you install XP SP3. You wouldn't believe the differences in answers on what you
have to do from HP and Microsoft are, and absolutely none it sounds safe for the XP operating system as of
July 2008.

https://msinfluentials.com/blogs/jesper/archive/2008/05/08/does-your-amd-based-computer-boot-after-installing-xp-sp3.aspx

HP support basically says to defrag hardrive and let Microsoft Update do it if the update is offered to you by Microsoft Update.

MS support tells you to jump through about five thousands hoops, ending with installing XP SP 3 in safe mode after dowloading
all 500 MB of the Service Pack 3 from the Microsoft download site.

I've got zero confidence in either method at this point. But I do have tons of emails describing how you do it if anyone is
interested.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2008, 02:44:23 PM by 3catkidneyfailure » Logged
menusux
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« Reply #260 on: July 06, 2008, 06:10:22 PM »

I have to confess that I refuse to take SP3.  Tongue  My problem with it is that it locks you into IE 7 as a browser and the only way to solve it is either not to accept SP3 or if you did, uninstall it.

When IE 7 first came out, I downloaded it and kept it on my system for about 15 minutes before uninstalling it.  For the work I was doing, IE 7 was making it twice long to do the job; what was easy for me to do with IE 6, turned into difficult with IE 7. 

Having an Intel CPU, that was the turn off for me--the browser being foisted on me.

Because I knew that I wouldn't take SP3 due to it containing IE 7, I did some reading about what's in there, and most experts wrote articles saying that if you've always done all the Microsoft updates prior to SP3, it was really a compilation of all of the updates.

Had seen that plenty of people were having the continual reboot problem after they installed it and I don't think every one with that problem had an AMD CPU either.

Not sure if I'd take HP's advice on this.  Knew someone years ago who had Dell and swore by it.  Late one night a problem developed and they called Dell's support number.  No idea what the tech was thinking, but he/she told them to be making a lot of reg edits. 

The result was that the 2 systems they used for their business were totally useless. 

When it wasn't working, they then called Microsoft CS and were told that everything Dell told them to do was totally wrong.

In order to get their information saved and get their systems running again, they had to pay through the nose for Dell to send a tech to their home (they worked from there).  The tech salvaged their information--their disks had to be formatted--Windows had to be reloaded along with all of their business software.

I personally couldn't feel comfortable with the thing either, when Microsoft tells you everything has to be done in safe mode.  They initially issued SP3, then pulled it, then issued it again.  You'd think that everything that was wrong would have been corrected when it was re-issued. 

http://download.microsoft.com/download/6/8/7/687484ed-8174-496d-8db9-f02b40c12982/Overview%20of%20Windows%20XP%20Service%20Pack%203.pdf

What's In Service Pack 3

Page 4

"Windows XP SP3 includes all previously released Windows XP updates, including security updates and hotfixes, and select out-of-band releases."

Previously released updates, etc. that are included cover pages 6-10.

Page 12

"Windows XP SP3 combines all previously released performance. security, and stability updates. It also provides a limited number of new and enhanced functionalities, although it does not significantly change the Windows XP experience or bring functionality from newer versions of Windows (Vista) to Windows XP. The goals of Windows XP3 are to:

"Provide a new baseline for customers still deploying Windows XP, to help them avoid the inconvenience of applying individual updates.

"Fill gaps in the updates users might have missed by declining individual updates when using Automatic Updates, and to deliver updates not made available through Windows Update."
« Last Edit: July 06, 2008, 06:37:07 PM by menusux » Logged
MarySmith
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« Reply #261 on: July 06, 2008, 06:42:13 PM »

How can you tell if you have installed XP SP3 ?

I had my computer set on Automatic Updates until I read so much about this issue. I use FireFox.
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MarySmith
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« Reply #262 on: July 06, 2008, 07:01:13 PM »

Mary,

You can go to Microsoft Updates and see what they will offer you to download.  I don't go through "Express" but "Custom" because I have refused two updates-- IE 7 and SP3.

Even though I have refused them, when I go to the Updates page, Microsoft will ask me if I want to change my mind and take either or both of them.

I'd say that if they're not offering to give you SP3, then you already have it.

I have Auto Updates on, but I have it set so that it doesn't download anything unless I OK it.  I have it set to notify me, but not to download anything without my consent.
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3catkidneyfailure
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« Reply #263 on: July 06, 2008, 08:01:27 PM »

Mary -- You can also check Control Panel, Add/Remove programs, and see if XP Service Pack 3 is installed on
your computer. If it is, it will show up there as a removable program.

Menusux, there's just one problem, there is a drop dead date for XP Service Pack 2. So after that, only SP3 will be
supported with security updates and patches. So there better be some fixes done for SP3, or I'm in trouble with an
HP AMD machine:

http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifean31

Support for Windows XP Service Pack 2 (SP2) will end on July 13, 2010. This date was established when Windows XP Service Pack 3 (SP3) was released on April 21, 2008.

This announcement is in line with the Microsoft Support Lifecycle policy for Windows service packs. This policy states that when a new service pack is released, Microsoft will provide 24 months of support for the previous service pack for products that belong to the Windows product family.

Note The release of a service pack has no impact on Mainstream Support and Extended Support end dates. Therefore, there will be no change to the previously announced end of Mainstream and Extended Support dates for Windows XP. Windows XP will transition from the Mainstream Support phase to the Extended Support phase on April 14, 2009, as scheduled. During the Extended Support phase for Windows XP, Microsoft will continue to provide paid support and security updates at no additional charge. Extended Support for Windows XP will retire on April 8, 2014.

For more information about support timelines for service packs, visit the Lifecycle Support Service Packs page at http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifesupsps
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menusux
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« Reply #264 on: July 06, 2008, 09:01:55 PM »

This is what's on HP's website about SP3 and AMD machines:

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?lc=en&cc=us&docname=c01457284&dlc=en

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/softwareList?os=228&lc=en&cc=us&lang=en&dlc=en&product=1162143

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/softwareDownloadIndex?softwareitem=pv-60484-2&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&product=1162143&os=228&lang=en

One of the links is advising the installation of it much as Microsoft told you--the last one offers a patch to install before you attempt to install SP3--

Operating system(s):    Microsoft Windows XP, Microsoft Windows XP Professional, Microsoft Windows XP Media Center, Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition
 
Download file size:      1.85M
 
System Requirements

You must be logged on as an administrator to install this update.
You must own an HP Pavilion, Presario or Media Center with Windows XP and an AMD processor.
You must install this update prior to applying Windows XP SP3 update.

So it looks like what they're saying is that you need to install the HP patch before doing anything with SP3 and that this HP patch is what will avoid the rebooting/system crashes.

OK--it looks like they are telling us here that if you install the patch at the link above, this is a workaround for you to be able to install SP3 normally after installing the HP patch--

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c01457284&lc=en&cc=us&dlc=en&product=1162143&os=228&lang=en

NOTE:  HP has provided a patch that prevents this issue from occurring. If your computer has this error, you must first use the steps in this document to resolve the issue before applying the patch. After the problem is resolved you can install sp37394 - Microsoft Windows XP SP3 Upgrade Utility for systems with AMD processors . Doing so, prevents the issue from occurring again and allows Service Pack 3 to be downloaded using Windows Updates. 

Am surprised that HP support didn't advise you of this patch since it was posted soon after the crashes and reboots started.  If you'd just gone along and let Auto Update install SP3 without this patch, it looks like you would have needed to go through a lot to first get it stopped and then still needed the patch and to re-do SP3.

This looks to be the fix for it but I believe I would call HP once more and verify that installing this patch before installing SP3 means that you're not going to have the crash and reboot issues.

This looks like it's the fix and it seems a lot more sensible than needing to go to safe mode to put SP3 in.  Wink
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3catkidneyfailure
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« Reply #265 on: July 07, 2008, 01:41:47 PM »

Thank you, Menusux. It looks to me like waiting a while
and hiring an IT person to install it is the safest way to
proceed. Nice when Microsoft issues a patch that only
IT people can install. I also have an additional issue, apparently,
with my wireless card installed by HP. This will be fun, not
to mention frustrating. All this on a computer model stickered
as "Vista compatible," which isn't Vista compatible, which is
the reason I bought this model in June 2006 when my desktop
crashed for the last time. Luck of the Irish ... lol
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Orange Fuzzball
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« Reply #266 on: July 07, 2008, 06:19:55 PM »

2010 is a ways off - I'm not too worried. I'm hoping in a year or so, most of the SP3 bugs will be worked out - until then, if it ain't broke, yanno. SP2 works just fine.
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menusux
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« Reply #267 on: July 08, 2008, 08:28:26 PM »

Today being "patch" Tuesday, I got auto notification that there were XP updates ready--less than 30 minutes ago, as a matter of fact.

Passed up their "nag" re: SP3 and took the one for XP and the monthly Malicious Software Removal Tool.  When I clicked to install these, I was confronted with a MS agreement before I was able to download any patches.  No patches if you don't accept the agreement.

I've had Windows since Win 95 and did updates for my OS through their website all this time, but this is the first time I've been asked to do an agreement before I installed any MS update/patch software.

Think it's sort of interesting that this "arrived" not very long after SP3 and the headaches some people have had after installing it.  I guess this is gonna be the "norm" from now on--be offered the agreement, accept it or no upgrades/patches.  Roll Eyes

CAUTION!!!

After downloading the XP security fix and rebooting my system, I was unable to connect to the internet.  I had to use System Restore to go back to a time before the patch was downloaded and applied.

I will NOT be downloading the patch again--not unless MS gets it worked out!!!!!!
« Last Edit: July 08, 2008, 10:56:38 PM by menusux » Logged
3catkidneyfailure
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« Reply #268 on: July 09, 2008, 09:43:25 AM »

Looks like, menusux, best advice is not to download XP patches for a couple of weeks after release by Microsoft.
Bill Gates, won't you please come home? Microsoft now screwing up XP badly (on purpose?).

http://itchmoforums.com/off-topic/current-microsoft-xp-updatewatch-out-t5489.0.html
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menusux
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« Reply #269 on: July 09, 2008, 10:06:51 AM »

The patch is an incompatibility with firewall ZoneAlarm.  I'm keeping ZA--have had a version of it since getting on the internet and have had no hassles with it ever.  No idea if the patch isn't compatible with other non-MS firewalls or not--haven't heard that.

When I was loading Norton System Works earlier this year and the install said that it wasn't compatible with ZA, I stopped the Norton install--the disk is back in the box.  I tried renewing a subscription to an earlier SW version and when I got to the auto downloads portion of that for SW, everything went wacky.

After many years of having a Norton product for A/V, I uninstalled that and went elsewhere for A/V that worked with ZA.

Have had ZA since before MS even HAD a firewall. 

The current ZA workaround suggests one set their DNS servers in the ZA Trusted Zone.  Took a look at mine and found they were in that zone all along--were there when the MS patch was applied.  My thought is that I am more at risk from uninstalling my firewall than from what the MS patch is meant to be protecting me from.  I'll wait to see what MS offers in the way of a second fix for this security update.

Sometimes you wonder whether or not this is a "message" to go to Vista--not doing that either.  Wink
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