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Offly_irked
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« Reply #90 on: July 07, 2008, 04:21:14 PM » |
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One thing, they've combined two - b subtillis & b licheniformis. It isn't just subtillis. http://www.ebi.ac.uk/2can/genomes/bacteria/Bacillus_subtilis.htmlWhile that, subtilliis, may be non pathogenic on its own, what about the combination with the unknown substances in the pet food that it is combining with and what is it creating? The intent, from what I gather, is that they are used to break substances down. http://www.ebi.ac.uk/2can/genomes/bacteria/Bacillus_subtilis.htmlOften, this is part of the rotting process. That's "fermentation". Not the kind that is known makes beer or wine, it's breaking down the food. Is that a digestive aid? Why is it needed considering the marketing hype for the product? What's the product/products/substances resulting from using those two bacteria in pet food?? I doubt that they remain in their original state when cooked and blended with unknowns. Riboflavin is made from the b subtillis fermentation process too. What else? How much is too much? B subtillis is one of the genus of bacteria used in food technology. The question brought up a long time ago, 1999, in reference to genetic engineering: http://www.organicconsumers.org/ge/scigedanger.cfm"These pathogenicity islands are thought to have originated from bacterial viruses which have integrated into bacterial genomes and picked up a range of virulence genes. They are highly mosaic, consisting of parts of plasmids and bacteria, particularly of those parts that might have been assembled into artificial vectors for genetic manipulation. Could genetic engineering have inadvertently contributed to creating pathogenicity islands? Could the newly discovered 'viteria' be pathogenicity islands that have gained independent existence as infectious particles? These are question which urgently need to be addressed. Cytomegalovirus, which the viteria most resembles, is one of the first viruses to be used as vector in genetic manipulation of animals, while E. coli and B. subtilis the top two
bacteria from which it has acquired genes are also the two most commonly
used bacteria in genetic engineering.http://www.ebi.ac.uk/2can/genomes/bacteria/Bacillus_licheniformis.htmlB licheniformis is aided by b subtilis in what way? Bacillus licheniformis is toxinogenic and food poisoning in humans has been associated with cooked meat, poultry and vegetable dishes (particularly stews and curries which have been served with rice). Food poisoning by Bacillus licheniformis is characterised by diarrhoea, although vomiting occurs in half of reported cases. |
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« Last Edit: July 07, 2008, 04:37:47 PM by Offy »
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Offly_irked
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« Reply #92 on: July 07, 2008, 06:50:52 PM » |
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A blog I ran across during discussions of Evangers was this: http://efoodalert.blogspot.com/A microbiologist, Phyllis Entis. I haven't found an email for her... I found a review of her book: http://www.cdc.gov/eid/content/13/6/960B.htmI thought about her tonite, as it would be moments like the ones I'm having with: Nutro® Ultra™ Adult :"Total Bacillus Species (MIN)** 283 Million CFU/lb (bacilius licheniformis & bacillius subtilis) "..and serving with rice. It would be nice if someone like her could join in and give some insight...or talk to the folks at CA... Question: GRAS is non pathogenic only or not? Mixed messages on licheniformis? References: GRAS (GRASP=GRAS affirmative petition) http://www.biosci.utexas.edu/ib/faculty/jansen/FS301%20papers/Olempska-Beer_2006.pdfBacillus licheniformis -amylase GRASP 0G0363;GRN 22; GRN 24;GRN 79 Pullulanase GRN 72 Bacillus subtilis -acetolactate 21 CFR 173.115 decarboxylase -amylase GRASP 4G0293; GRASP 7G0328 Maltogenic amylase GRASP 7G0326 Pullulanase GRN 20 Note: emailed Alltech for Bio-Mos trial results for companion animals (dogs, rabbits) |
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« Last Edit: July 07, 2008, 08:23:36 PM by Offy »
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Sandi K
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« Reply #93 on: July 07, 2008, 07:23:43 PM » |
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Offy, you might be on to something here. If I remember correctly Phyllis Entis is pretty good at responding to comments at her blog. Im wondering if you could post a comment to her most recent blog article asking if she would consider coming to Itchmo to help us with some questions.....its worth a try.....I couldnt find an e:mail contact for her either.
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JJ
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« Reply #95 on: July 07, 2008, 11:46:07 PM » |
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Great site yl. Spells out the genetically modified food and the gradual organ destruction over a period of years that you would never suspect was due to the food being genetically modified. No more regular potatoes for this house after reading this site. Thx again!! |
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'Life isn't about how to survive the storm,
But how to dance in the rain.'
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Mandycat
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« Reply #96 on: July 08, 2008, 12:05:30 AM » |
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What is actually being used in pet foods, Nutro and others, is Dried Bacillus Licheniformis Fermentation Extract and Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract. This is not the same as the organism itself. It is something extracted from the organism in a process that uses a non-pathogenic strain and produces a product that is non-toxic. I found this definition in this document on the AAFCO website.
http://www.aafco.org/Portals/0/powerpoint/enzyme_labeling_for_feeds.ppt
"Dried _________Fermentation Extract is the dried product resulting from extracting and precipitating by means of non-aqueous solvents or other suitable means, the water soluable materials from a fermentation conducted for maximum production of enzymes using a non-pathogenic strain of the microorganism in accordance with good manufacturing practices."
On several websites, the use of these ingredients is stated to be as a Probiotic.
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« Last Edit: July 08, 2008, 01:20:40 AM by Mandycat »
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Sandi K
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« Reply #97 on: July 08, 2008, 10:43:00 PM » |
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And the complaints just keep on a comin' (plus another touting how good the food is). I noticed one of them said they were told there is a secret recall going on.....and another was told there is an employee strike, another was told they are reformulating their food, another was told it was manufacturing variances....: http://www.consumeraffairs.com/pets/nutro.html Nutro Pet Foods
Terri of Canby OR (07/08/08)
After numerous sensitivities to various pet foods not to mention $100's of dollars I spent on vet bills for chronic ear yeast infections, I finally found a FANTASTIC food for my pets. It's Nutro Natural Choice Lamb and Rice. I have had my two dogs on Natural choice for the last 6 years. Their coat is awesome and so shiney. I also have 8 cats. They are on the Nutro Max dry cat food. My cats range in age,6-15. They are all healthy and ornery as heck.
I'm so thankful to have found NUTRO.
Rosanne of Albuquerque NM (07/08/08)
I have been feeding my dog Nutro lamb and rice for large breeds for about 3 years. He was fine until about a month ago when I tried to find the above mentioned food and I could not find anyone in town who had it - they all said there was a shortage and they had been unable to get it from Nutro.
This posed a serious problem as I have a rotweiller and they have sensitive digestive systems so switching to another type of nutro food was not something I was looking forward to. We had no choice so we bought the blue bag of nutro that has chicken and corn in it and after 3 days on that food our dog had terrible diarrhea and was very lethargic. So then we decided to try the other lamb and rice dog food nutro makes and our dog started vomitting everyday, began to lose weight and was extremely lethargic.
At this point I decided to do some research on the internet on nutro and was horrified to read all the other consumer complaints. We have switched our dog to Eagle Pack dog food and after being sick for over a month while on Nutro he is so much better now. I hope there is a class action law suit against Nutro.
Sally of Tucson AZ (07/08/08)
When I saw that Nutro was rapidly disapering, I e-mailed them and asked what was going on. I was told that they were re-forulating the food and that it would soon be back on the shelves. (I was also told by an employee of PetCo that Nutro was dealing with an employee strike).
I e-mailed Nurto back, asking what they were changing in their foods. No reaction. My 12 year old Golden Mix has, until last winter, been healthy and spry.... I have to wonder if this has something to do with the dietary change. I was lucky during the dog food recall NOT to have bought a bag with the numbers on the recall list, but with Sandy's health suddenly going down, I'm going to change foods.
Enough is enough! Sandy, like other dogs, has been eatting a great deal of grass this summer. Dogs usually don't eat grass unless their tummies are bothering them. Personally, I'd like to know just WHAT has changed in Nurto Pet Foods.
My dog is not feeling well - she doen't eat like she used to and her energy is very low. Yes, she's old. But dogs don't loose their energy overnight for no reason.
Rebecca of Gray ME (07/07/08)
My 2 year old chocolate lab began vomiting every 20 minutes on the morning of 7/6/2008 and became so lethargic we had to take her to the emergency vet clinic. As of now 3:45 PM on 7/7/2008 she is still there getting medication and IV's. She was diagnosed with pancreatitis but after seeing today the 6/23/2008 consumeraffairs.com posting (Illness, Death Dog Nutro Pet Food Company denies a link to scores of sudden illness By Lisa Wade McCormick) about Nutro lamb & rice's potential tie with sick and/or dying dogs we now wonder if it was the food as her symptoms/experience mimic those in the article.
Given this potential issue, the vet will now be running additional and follow-up tests to monitor liver and kidney function. I intend to save the remaining food. Thank you for getting the word out with your article as it seems Nutro is not making it widely known.
Vet bills (currently totaling around $800-1,000 but we anticipate this to rise due to follow-up care/monitoring bills we anticipate) Stained carpet in a home and a vehicle which will need to be replaced and/or professionally cleaned as store-bought cleaners promptly applied have not removed the stains.
Jen of Gilbert AZ (07/07/08)
I have a english bulldog that has been on Nutro products all of her life. Up until about 3 months ago she was great on them. Now I swear to NEVER by another NUTRO product again. My dog is highly allergic to something that is in the product. She was on Lamb and rice, but since they have changed the food she cant handle it. She would get these welts all over her body, and her face would swell like she was in a boxing match.
I took her to the vet and she said it is something in the food. We pulled the nurto from her, and started making our own food trying to pin point what she is allergic to. Since then (2 weeks now) she's great! No bumps or swelling. Until now I was a huge fan of NUTRO.I am sicken by the fact that I can no longer trust NUTRO products. How dare they risk my dogs well being? My dog can not be replaced, but NUTRO can and has been. I will tell everyone I know that this product is now junk.
My dog was sick, had welts all over her body and looked liked freak. Her eyes swelled shut and she couldnt stop itching. I bought all sorts of dips, creams, lotions before taking her to the vet. There she got a shot that costs 95 dollars. All this due to some junk NUTRO put in their food.
Deborah of Dover DE (07/07/08)
We purchased a new bag of Nutro Natural Choice Lamb and Rice on June 22nd 2008. The food did not look like usual so I called Nutro to ask if there was a problem. The man I spoke to read me an explaination - twice -which didn't answer my question but I could get not further. He said it was manufacturing variances.
I assumed the food was ok. That was two weeks ago. Our Lab's feces began to have a very strong,sick, sweet dead animal smell and was immediately being covered with flies. Then on July 2nd she started vomiting and vomiting and vomiting. Somehow she seemed to vomit more food then I fed her. She was ravenous for grass and was attacking the lawn like a starving sheep. She vomited again.
Then our Shiba started with runny stool. In five years he has NEVER been sick-NEVER. We looked on the internet and found similar stories - unfotunately with tragic endings. We stopped using the Nutro immediately and the dogs are now fine and the feces smells like feces again. Thank you for your site and the information you share. It may have saved our dogs' lives. But what is going on ?
Sandra of Longview TX (07/07/08)
I took my 3 dogs in for their yearly checkup on Monday June 23rd. All was fine. I started them on what I was hoping was a good dog food on June 24th. I bought the Nutro Ultra Adult formula. By Thurs. the 26th I had 3 lethargic, sick vomiting dogs. They were drinking loads of water. I took the sickest one to the vet on Saturday and got medicine for the other two. I took them off the food Thursday night, they wouldn't eat anyway, too sick.
Sunday they started eating again. I tried giving the food one more time to one of the dogs, she vomited it up a little later. My two outside dogs never got the food and never got sick so I don't believe it was a virus. I also had gotten a new dog that was still in quarantine from the others. She didn't eat the food and didn't get sick either.
Most unexpected vet bill after just having their checkups done the day before giving the food. I had to force syringes of electrolytes into them to keep them hydrated. Also gave them a dietary supplement gel for nutrition, plus the meds.
Catherine of Arlington TX (07/07/08)
I work in a retail petstore and for the last few months we have had trouble getting in the Nutro dogfood large breed lamb and rice and a few of the other varieties. Our rep constantly towed the line that it was an ingredient supply and manufacturing issue. I told the rep that the new packaging was difficult for the customers to recognize and why those changes... he again said that they were reformulating for ingredient shortages. I now find out that a dog food company can change their food formula for SIX months without needing the change labelling.
Co-incidentally, I have noticed that in the last month or two, my two purebred great pyrenees dogs have been having bouts of diarrhea and vomiting. I had attributed that to eating grass and perhaps drinking pool water, though my five year old female pyr (has been fed Nutro her whole life) has been refusing to eat kibble for the past week or so. She has been getting some canned supplements to encourage her to eat. Yesterday at work, a customer told us that Nutro is under a secret recall. I was skeptical, because our Nutro rep has always assured us of the safety of their product... My husband commented today that our female looked terrible... dull coat, lethargic.
I saw both dogs vomit and promptly looked for info online. and there it is: my dog's symptoms correlating with this last bag of food. It is now in the garbage, and I will NOT feed Nutro ever again. Now our store will be in an ethical quandary. how can we sell what we know is a potentially dangerous product? We have a responsibility to tell what we know to prevent other dog deaths. Why isn't Nutro being open about this? Can the government publicize for us?
No vet bills yet, though to get a quality replacement food, I am now buying Nature's Variety Prairie, beef and barley at double the cost of the nutro. $48 per 30lb bag.
Nina of Detona FL (07/06/08)
I have 3 dog's on Nutro dog food. They have been on this food for approx. 3 month's now and since this time they eat grass constantly vomit off and on, drink a lot of water, i did become alarmed whe my dog Logan vomited a large amount of clear fluid with blood speck's twice in an hour would not eat drank water excessively. I took Logan to my vet and was told he probably had an intestinal infection and they prescribed antibiotic's.
I did question the food since it seemed that this all started when i switched fron Science diet to Nutro dog food, and then did some research on my pet's symptom's and Nutro dog food came up. I learned that a great majoriety of pet owner's that had their pet's on Nutro were experiencing similar problem's and some lost their family member's.I have taken ALL my animal's off this food as i feel my pet's illness is due to the Nutro dog food.
I took Logan to my vet he is being treated we are hoping he will get better but i suffer emotional grief as i lost my 20 yr. old cat due to tainted food, at that time it was science diet morcels with gravy. I am so worried that i might lose my Logan i have been through so much i don't know if i can handle this.
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Sandi K
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« Reply #98 on: July 08, 2008, 11:05:34 PM » |
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Found this at Pet Food Industry magazine, so its all settled, Nutro set the record straight so move along. According to this magazine its a simple case of "Reduced retail availability of Nutro products may have sparked rumors of food safety problems." ..  http://www.petfoodindustry.com/ViewNews.aspx?id=22258Nutro sets record straight
Over the past several months, ConsumerAffairs.com, a self-proclaimed consumer news center, has been posting statements and consumer complaints about Nutro petfood products
Over the past several months, ConsumerAffairs.com, a self-proclaimed consumer news center, has been posting statements and consumer complaints about Nutro petfood products. Nutro states these postings draw false links between illness and death among pets and the consumption of Nutro petfoods. It further points out the website is not affiliated with the US Consumer Product Safety Commission or Consumer Reports.
Reduced retail availability of Nutro products may have sparked rumors of food safety problems. Currently, there are worldwide shortages of ingredients across the human and pet food industries and Nutro has had its share of supply problems. As a result, there are certain Natural Choice Lamb and Rice products for dogs that are in short supply in certain locations.
In some of the cases, in a June 23 posting on ConsumerAffairs.com, outside sources have provided verification that Nutro products were not the cause of any pet health issues. In others, Nutro is taking steps to address pet owners' concerns and determine the cause of the pet health issues, according to Debra Fair, Public Relations Manager at Nutro. But at this point, she says, every Nutro product analyzed in relation to the June 23 posting on ConsumerAffairs.com has been shown to be safe. |
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Carol
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« Reply #99 on: July 09, 2008, 04:20:42 AM » |
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So glad to see Pet Food Industry newsletter clearing this all up----- . It is strange that they decide to cover this story but yet won't cover how Mars/Effem screwed up with identifying the contaminant of the 2004 Asian recall---which I pointed out TWICE in emails to the editor which I have already posted here so I know she got the first one (she ignored the second one)---just imagine if as much attention was put on the real poisons of 2004 and may have prevented 2007?? I wish they would cover both sides of pet food problems....obviously they are not fair and balanced!  |
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“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.” — Margaret Mead
United we stand Divided we fall....
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Carol
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« Reply #100 on: July 09, 2008, 05:57:27 AM » |
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Lesson to be learned.....rumors are not always that... this is from March 2004 --not current...>: ( http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/biz/archives/2004/03/24/2003107583Earlier this month more than 100 dogs reportedly fell ill and about 30 others had died from renal illness after eating Pedigree in Taiwan.
Effem Foods dismissed the reports as rumors at that time and has offered to spend NT$1 million to find a scientific explanation for the dogs' illness and death. But in the meantime, the company started to recall its pet food manufactured at the Thailand plant to eliminate any remaining concerns about the quality and safety of its products. |
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“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.” — Margaret Mead
United we stand Divided we fall....
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Offly_irked
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« Reply #101 on: July 09, 2008, 06:36:39 AM » |
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Mars, as we know from the CDC report, did not recall all the pet foods associated with illness in humans either... http://itchmoforums.com/news-recall-related/mars-pennsylvania-plant-did-not-recall-all-contaminated-products-t5236.0.html;msg69917#msg69917Established Track record for handling of complaints regarding human or animal health: Effem, Mars PA I'm sure Nutro really set us all straight with their magazine blurb. Worldwide shortages? How many other pet food companies using those ingredients that Nutro claims are short are having the same customer complaints? Bags, reformulations, shortages. We could probably make a list of companies over the same time period as Nutro. Then ,add customer complaints and see where the cookie kibble crumbles.. |
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« Last Edit: July 09, 2008, 06:43:11 AM by Offy »
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menusux
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« Reply #102 on: July 10, 2008, 12:00:44 PM » |
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http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/caninevitality/archives/142981.asp?from=blog_last3Illness and Death Connected to Nutro Pet Food |July 9, 2008 (Saundra details what CA has reported about deaths and illnesses attributed to Nutro foods in her blog entry.) "These facts were reported in an article by Lisa Wade McCormick of ConsumerAffairs.com, dated 6/23/08. "Since Lisa wrote this article on June 23, I contacted her yesterday to see if they were getting any more complaints. She told me they are continuing to get reports from pet guardians everyday. She was very happy that I was posting her report to my site and to this blog."I contacted Nutro and I will comment on that conversation tomorrow." Saundra Bailey is an author and a pet nutrition expert. I would expect her conversation with Nutro will appear here on her blog today or Friday.
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Sandi K
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« Reply #103 on: July 10, 2008, 05:11:58 PM » |
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Menusux, another good find! Thank you. I didnt know about this site. I just checked and she indicates that info about her conversation with Nutro should be their tomorrow.....Im all ears......or eyes.....  |
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kaffe
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« Reply #104 on: July 10, 2008, 05:40:49 PM » |
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he he he I am ALL ears and eyes too!
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