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eclaire1981
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« on: December 20, 2009, 05:38:06 AM » |
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2 of my cats are free feed of dry food. and 2 meals of homecooked per day. 1 portion of homemade food is added 50ml water to it for them not to be dehydrated. calcium is added accordingly. 2 drop of dulse, 1/3 of salmon oil(1000mg), dash of vit b50, dash of taurine, 1/3vit E to each of every 1 portion. When it be too much? how much should i add for salmon oil and vit E since they are eating dry commercial food.
My another cat that is having crf, is now again eating homemade food again. All vitamins are added serparately as well to the 1 portion in order that my cat get the vitamins. How much should i added to the portion? i added 2 drop of dulse, 3 dash of taurine and vit B since they are water soluble? 1/3 salmon oil and 1/3 vit E to his each meal too. he ate 4 meal too. so salmon oil may add to 1 and 1/3 salmon oil and vit E. How much should i add for the vitamins?
Thanks. And do i still need feed any vitamins , like nucat if i feed purely homemade for 2nd cat. Thanks in advance...
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« Last Edit: December 20, 2009, 05:39:54 AM by eclaire1981 »
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petslave
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« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2009, 12:18:02 AM » |
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To be safe, stay with what trusted home made recipes recommend rather than guessing at amounts of supplements to add. Since you want all meals to be balanced most of the time, supplement the home made as directed in the recipe. That way the dry commercial food meals and the home made meals are both balanced.
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Spartycats
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« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2009, 05:44:39 AM » |
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I think Eclaire is using Cato's recipes. They have all the supplements added to the whole batch. I think she wants to add the supplements at each meal. I have also read to do this, because vitamins/supplements will degrade with freezing and re-heating. So I think she is asking how to figure what amounts for each meal.
I know some commercial supplements (BalanceIt), give you a recipe and an amount of their supplement to mix with the food each day. Unfortunately, my cats will not eat anything with BalanceIt, plus you need your veterinarian to get special (renal) recipes.
Do others here just not worry about this? Do you just add supplements to the whole recipe?
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lesliek
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« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2009, 07:34:57 AM » |
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Some things I add to the whole recipe & some I add in each meal. With 5 its hard to do all supplements each time,as it is it takes about 30 minutes.
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"the world's most inept extortionist"
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Cato
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« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2009, 10:11:23 AM » |
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Eclaire: I think I understand what you want to do - lots of home cookers also like adding the supplements to their cats' meals just before feeding - especially taurine and salmon/fish oil. Please supply me with the following information:
1. Name EACH supplement (vitamins or minerals or amino acid) that you have and are presently adding to your cats' meal. And this is important: Please include the milligrams or IU that is on the label of each. For example, if you have liquid dulse, the label should tell you that for every teaspoon, there is such-and-such amount of iodine, trace minerals... BETTER yet, post EVERYTHING that is on the label of each of your supplement so we don't miss any vital information. This way, we can give you a better idea of how much to of each to add.
2. Give me an estimate in grams or teaspoons or tablespoons of home made food that each of your cat eats per day.
3. What recipe home made food are you making and giving? Is it T&T without the supplements? I hope you are adding the eggshell powder!
You know, some home-feeders have had pretty good success in just adding a calcium supplement like eggshell powder or calcium citrate or calcium carbonate to the home-made to balance the phosphorus. They would just then give the cat one or two multi-vitamin/mineral supplement every day, depending on what the vitamin label suggests. If you were feeding raw, the supplements (except calcium) would not be too big an issue...
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petslave
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« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2009, 09:39:22 PM » |
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I make 6-9 double batches of the T&T recipe at a time. I add eggshell and freeze them as double batches. I thaw, add the other supplements (B50, salmon oil & Vit E, taurine), mix and feed. A double batch feeds 4 cats for 5-6 meals here.
I don't freeze the food with supplements other than eggshell because I worry it may affect them. Not sure if that's incorrect, but I'd rather be safe.
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eclaire1981
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« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2009, 11:43:27 PM » |
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HI,
Thanks for all the reply,
Cato, the recipe i use is T & T.
Vit E is 200IU
Salmon oil is 1000mg
2 tabs B50 complex
1tsp ground eggshell
1000mg taurine
1/8 tsp dulse.(on label written-serving size 4drops is 0.2ml, iodine 225mcg) 1/8 tsp is 1.56ml
For this recipe, i can make 32 oz of homemade.
so 2 oz is 1 meal for my cat. 4 meals a day for my crf cat. Total 8 oz a day
For every 8 oz, 1/4 tsp of eggshell is added before freezing.
The rest of supplement is added serparately before each meal to ensure every 2 oz is having sufficient vitamins.
For every 2 oz, 2 dash of taurine and 2 dash vit b50 is added. 0.4ml dulse is added. 1/4 capsule of salmon oil(1000mg) is added. 1/4 vit E200iu is added too for every of Yoi meal.
Is it too much salmon oil is added? Daily consumption is 1000mg and 1 capsule vit E. So should i give 1/4 capsule salmon oil and vit E to only his 1 meal, the rest remain the same since taurine and and vit B is water soluble.
Yoi is having 100% homecooked now. Should i give him any other vitamins like Nucat?
For my other 2 cats, they are mostly half commercial and half homemade. Same quantity of vitmains are added to their each home made meal. I will still add dulse, vit B and taurine. However since they are on half commercial, should i add salmon oil and Vit E too? If yes, how much should i give in order that i do not overdose them with Vit E. Thanks.
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« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 11:48:13 PM by eclaire1981 »
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Cato
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« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2009, 12:52:50 PM » |
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Eclaire: Good job. Thanksfor posting the relevant info on the supplements. For the T&T recipe, (or any other recipe), it is best to add the eggshell or whatever calcium source you are using when you make the whole batch just prior to freezing. The other supplements like taurine, B-50, fish oil, etc may be added later just before you feed. And the amount of each supplement you are adding to each of the 2-oz meals sounds about right. The only thing I would change are:
1. Make sure that each cat gets at least 100mg of taurine everyday (80mg at the very minimum). You cannot really over-dose on taurine since it is water soluble so just to be on the safe side, add just a tad more than the "dash" you put in each meal.
2. 1000mg of salmon oil and 200IU of vitamin E for the CRF cat is OK, depending on the cat's weight. If your cat is less than 10 pounds, reduce to 800mg salmon oil and 100IU Vit E. If you can, add 10mg of Co-Q10 to this daily. It has been shown that a daily regimen of salmon oil + Vit E + Co-Q10 can be a powerful renal protective - i.e., it actually slows down the progression of renal disease. This tegime is for the CRF cat only. For the others, 250mg salmon oil and 50IU Vit E per day is plenty.
3. Dulse. Skip a dose in one of the cats' meals. We don't want too much iodine if we can help it (even though dulse has far less iodine than kelp).
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eclaire1981
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« Reply #9 on: December 23, 2009, 08:28:10 PM » |
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Hi Cato,
For my crf cat, i do know what the vitamins quantity to add already. Thanks alot.
But for my other normal cats, you mentioned 250mg and 50IU a day is plenty. so how much should i give , since they are already on commercial dry food mostly at least half or 2/3 of their daily meals?
All my homemade food, liver are alway included. Will it be too many Vit A? Or should i exclude liver some time a while?
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Cato
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« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2009, 10:14:16 PM » |
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Eclaire: 250mg of salmon oil (1/4 of a 1000mg gelcap) and 50IU of Vit E in their home made cat food. That's what I meant. It isn't absolutely necessary to supplement the healthy cats with salmon oil and vit E if they are eating some commercial food that contains fish oil. Oh - only COD LIVER OIL has vitamin A and D. Salmon Oil has Omega 3 and 6, but no Vit A or D.
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eclaire1981
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« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2009, 03:24:25 AM » |
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Hi Cato,
Thanks alot.
im meaning liver is alway added in my homemade oer to T & T recipe. And i had read you had wrote before-liver everyday maybe no good, occasionally exclude liver is fine too. So i would like to enquire more. How about pig liver occasionally. It has less Vit A. Thanks.
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Cato
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« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2009, 09:22:05 AM » |
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Hi Cato,
Thanks alot.
im meaning liver is alway added in my homemade over to T & T recipe. And i had read you had wrote before-liver everyday maybe no good, occasionally exclude liver is fine too. So i would like to enquire more. How about pig liver occasionally. It has less Vit A. Thanks.
 You're learning plenty! If you are in Asia, it is probably not a very good idea to use pig liver. You see, in most Asian small farms (and I've lived in Asia), they feed pigs anything and everything, so, we cannot know for certain how healthy a pig's liver would be, given the liver filters and detoxifies most foods AND stores many things. So, just to be on the safe side, stick to chicken livers. And I would use an Asian chicken raised on a small Asian farm or home over the chickens here that are raised in mega-chicken hatcheries with their oer-use of growth hormones and antibiotics. |
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eclaire1981
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« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2009, 02:56:52 AM » |
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Hi Cato,
I saw before your post mentioning of a supplement or vitamins from brand Now Foods that can make a black cat fur not to be reddish. What is the name of vitamin? I cant remember where is the post? Also i just choose normal frozen chicken and buy fresh chicken liver, not knowing where the chicken come from. But i would like to enquire , so every meal i follow your recipe with liver included, is it fine to have it every meal right?
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Cato
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« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2009, 09:11:14 AM » |
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It is called L-Alanine.
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