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Janet
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« on: August 20, 2008, 10:07:07 AM » |
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My 16 year old girl was doing very well with her CRF up until about 10 days ago.
I believe we are near the end.
She was diagnosed in Jan. 07 and has taken very good care of herself, drinking tons of water and eating well. She has had a happy life with us.
We had to suspend Sub Qs early on because she hated it so much. Long story, but she does not like to be messed with and it affected our quality of life together.
She has been happy and has dealt well with her disease for 18 months.
I was curious about some of your experiences with your CRF kitties. How long did your kitty survive after the diagnosis? Is 18 months a good life expectency for this disease?
My vet at the time of diagnosis did not push the idea of fluids on us. His theory was that eventually the fluids were of no help either.
I am of course feeling very very sad now and feel guilty for not forcing the fluids on her even though we were not at all friends when this was happening.
Thanks.
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petslave
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« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2008, 10:58:37 AM » |
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I'm sorry your Bennie girl is starting to be pulled down by her CRF, Janet. My 14 year old cat did well for 2 years on subq fluids, then it wasn't enough anymore and he declined quickly. But this was 2 years after he started getting fluids 2x a week. It sounds like you are fairly sure she's near the end of her fight now, but just some thoughts here if you want to keep trying. Have you had Bennie's numbers checked since this decline? It might help to see where she is at.
Also, as they feel worse, they are much easier to give fluids to. If you can get some fluids in her, maybe 100ml for a few days, then a few times a week, you may still have some good time together. Check with your vet on this though. I'm dealing with this with my CRF cat that was diagnosed last year. Fluids are very difficult with her now that she is feeling good, but she was easy to give them to when she was really sick last year. So I'm going to hold off on giving them to her till she starts doing worse. They really do pick up with the fluids, so there may be some hope yet for Bennie since she's been doing well without them so far.
Prayers to both of you.
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JustMe
Administrator
Hero Member
Posts: 7929
Elvis
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« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2008, 11:13:12 AM » |
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I'm so sorry about your Bennie. Petslave posted some good ideas. I would also recommend talking to your vet and see if they can do fluids for her so you're not the bad guy. Or maybe they can do some IV fluids for Bennie.
I've got limited experience with it, couldn't do the subcutaneous fluids with a different cat I had, but was able to bring her to the vet 3 times a week for her subcutaneous fluids. She'd eat much better after her fluids.
I think it depends on the individual cat and the cat's numbers. My oldest has had early CRF for about 5 years. We do have blood tests run annually, so we knew about it back then. If your cat likes wet food, I'd try to get him on wet rather than dry (if that is what he is on) as it helps hydrate them. But truly whatever food he likes to eat give him. He needs to eat.
There are people here who have much more experience with CRF.
I hope your vet can help both of you. {{{hugs}}}
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"One cat just leads to another." ~ Ernest Hemingway
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kittylyda
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« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2008, 12:17:36 PM » |
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Hi Janet. I'm so sorry to hear that Bennie is not doing well. Try not to feel guilty about not forcing the fluids on her. If she was completely traumatized by the fluids and was stressed out all time that would not have done her any good either. And I know some kitties really hold it against you when you yourself do some kind of medicating or procedure on them. It can really affect your relationship and they can grow to fear you and that is no way for you or your kitty to live.
That being said, as JustMe suggested it might be worth taking her in to the vet so that they can administer some fluids and do some bloodwork. Her kidney levels would tell you exactly how sick she is. It may not be as bad as you think and as petslave said, it is much easier to give fluids when they are not feeling well. There is even a chance that she may get used to the hydration while she is feeling unwell and it may not be as big a deal in the future. As an alternative, before I knew how to give fluids what I would do for one of my cats is take a plastic infant medicine dropper, one of the large ones, and shoot about 3ml's of water down her throat 3 or 4 times a day. Bennie might be beyond this, but extra water certainly could not hurt. Water mixed into wet food is always a good idea too.
My cat was diagnosed with renal insufficiency during the March 2007 recalls and since then we have been giving her fluids twice a week. It's been a year and a half since she was diagnosed and she is doing very well. She is old as the hills though, probably about 20, so I don't know how much longer she will be with us either.
I hope this helps. Keep us posted on Bennie.
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3catkidneyfailure
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« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2008, 12:42:48 PM » |
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Janet, I'm so sorry that Bennie is not doing well with crf. My two survivors were
diagnosed in January 2007. Their numbers are going up with home subqs three times
a week. If you can afford the vet treatment, then your cat does not blame you, but
I know it's very high cost. It should help. You won't know what it is that's going on
with Bennie unless you have bloodwork to assist. I've heard time frames mentioned
of one to five year survival times. There are treatable complications, and some that
are not. My heart is with you, Janet, because whatever one does, this is not easy.
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« Last Edit: August 21, 2008, 10:05:40 AM by 3catkidneyfailure »
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catwoods
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« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2008, 01:26:48 PM » |
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Sorry to hear this Janet. I hope that maybe the fluids will be beneficial for Bennie, and that you can find a way to do it with the least stress. Prayers and purrs for the both of you.
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my4meezers
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« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2008, 01:38:50 PM » |
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Janet, I recently lost the second of my 2 CRF cats. One survived only a few months, the one who just passed away survived 2.5 years after diagnosis. I think it all depends on the cat.
Emile (the one who only survived a few months) would become absolutely terrified when we tried to give him sub-qs. He would hide for days afterwards, so like you we had to make the difficult decision to stop giving sub-qs. His quality of life was horrible on sub-qs so we chose quality over quantity. I would not have changed a thing. He was a very timid cat and our bond grew so much greater during his final weeks once we stopped the sub-qs. I was able to hold and cuddle him by his choice for the first time in his life. I know in my heart it was his way of letting me know he loved me and didn't want me to regret my decision.
You know your girl better than anyone, and you made a selfless decision to make her remaining time happy, no matter how long it is. There is absolutely no reason to feel guilty for that. She is very lucky to have a mom who loves her as much as you obviously do. I know how incredibly hard it is when you see the end coming, but remember to cherish every moment you have left together. My heart goes out to you and your girl.
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Janet
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« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2008, 03:17:31 PM » |
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Thank you so much everyone.
I took Bennie to a a Cat Clinic (new vet) last week and got her hydrated and had her numbers checked.
Her numbers were very good! But her urine specific gravity was dilute.
They suspect she may also be hyperthyroid and that condition distorts the Bun and Creatinine numbers, making them appear better than they really are. (I did pick up a bag of sub-qs today and perhaps since she is much weaker than she was the last time we tried it, it may work. We'll see.)
We have run a special T4 test that takes a couple days to get back. Should have results tomorrow.
If she is hyperthyroid, I have no idea how you tell what her Bun and Creatinine readings really are.
If she is not hyperthyroid, it would indicate some internal problem, since her numbers indicate only early renal disease.
Thanks for your understanding of our decision to not continue with the sub-qs. my4meezers, Bennie is just like Emile and we also made the choice to retain our loving relationship rather than have Bennie spend her remaining time hiding in the closet. But right now that decision makes me cry.
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Carol
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« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2008, 03:43:39 PM » |
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Janet, Bennie sounds like my Jessica who was affected by her food in Feb of 2007 (Special Kitty) and although her kidney values did come down by November, she was diagnosed with hyperthyroid in November but could not tolerate the medication...it made her kidneys much worse...she was 16....she never had sub q's except she did have fluids at the vets three times the first week she was diagnosed with acute renal failure in feb '07...I wish you the best of luck with the sub-q's ... it is a very hard place to be... I am interested in knowing if more kitties had hyperthyroid diagnosed after the poisoning....I think you said the renal failure was from the food?
Good wishes coming your way...
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catbird
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« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2008, 05:03:34 PM » |
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Janet, I have little experience with CRF (only cats who had it were so mild that they never needed treatment), but send my best wishes that you will find solutions for Bennie. I understand completely about quality of life versus quantity. {{{hugs}}}
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lesliek
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« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2008, 06:53:03 PM » |
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Janet- My Patches made it 20 mo's,but we were able to do subq's without a problem. I know thats not possible with all cats.I would try the fluids again while Bennie is feeling bad,it may go better.Sending prayers and positive thoughts to you for good test results and an improvement in Bennie's overall health.I'm sure you will make any decisions based on what is best for her,and send you support for whatever you need to do.Quality of life does matter,not just length of it.
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"the world's most inept extortionist"
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Orange Fuzzball
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« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2008, 07:55:33 PM » |
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Janet, I'm so sorry to hear Bennie's not doing well.  I know it's hard not to feel guilty. But I have to agree with the other posters that quality of life is more important than quantity. If you'd forced subq's on Bennie when she wasn't tolerating it, it might have given her a bit more time, but she wouldn't have enjoyed that time as much as she has. 18 months of quality time is nothing to sneeze at. I hope that you and your vet are able to find a treatment that will give her even more. But if her time has indeed come, you have nothing to feel guilty about. To know when it's time to let go is a gift to her as well. I hope that when KD's time comes, I am able to do what's right for her. Wishing you and Bennie peace, no matter what the outcome. |
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Janet
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« Reply #13 on: August 21, 2008, 07:00:57 AM » |
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I am interested in knowing if more kitties had hyperthyroid diagnosed after the poisoning....I think you said the renal failure was from the food?
Yes Carol, I believe Bennie was a victim of the pet food poisoning. She was eating a non recalled canned food for Senior cats, manufactured by you know who, that contained rice gluten. She suddenly began drinking large amounts of water and urinating heavily in November or December of 2006 (can't remember which month exactly). We are still waiting for a call from the vet about the hyperthyroid test. I'll post her results when we get them. |
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catmom5
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« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2008, 07:04:07 AM » |
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I believe it started long before the "announced" recalls started. CJ was affected in November of 2006.
I hope you get good news about Bennie. It's soooo hard to deal with a chronically ill cat or dog.
Will keep those prayers coming for you.
cm?
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